Hablemos de la v4

[Covenant]

Lo que se deduce de las últimas novedades es:

El recon solo vale para ampliar despliegue, siendo su función durante la partida en si "0". Como en TY vamos. Supongo que se producirán masivos ajustes de puntos porque si no ni dios lo debería poner...y con razón.

Recortes y generalizaciones en las reglas especiales, hasta el punto de que un cazatanques americano dispone de prácticamente la misma regla que un infante alemán. Porque recordar reglas distintas era muy complicado, ya sabéis. No se que puñetas pinta un gaitero en una compañia de ghurkas. ¿Desaparece el SF?. El recorte al night attack estaba claro, tienen que vender aviación...

Intentando solucionar el problema del relleno rancio en reservas, ahora cambian de 50% de unidades del ejercito a 40% de puntos. Como si solucionase el problema y no es previsible la aparición de "superunidades" (como phanters, churchills, etc en mid) para dejar en reservas una única unidad y que esta venga pronto a la mesa. Si es que...

Total annihilation? Lo que faltaba...

[Covenant]

Copy & Paste actualizado de la lista de Tio Sam: En negrita casi todo lo nuevo que implica algún cambio respecto a su post (añadido tambien cosas que no cambian respecto a la anterior edición):

EDIT: No me ha pillado la negrita al hacer copy paste, sorry.

Made some updates based of a 2nd listen and reading posts elsewhere.

Recon
+ Recon units can deploy up to 16" from an enemy team or enemy deployment zone.
+ Once deployed the Recon team creates an 8" "bubble" that other units can later deploy in. I/m not sure later deployment is effected by distance from enemy teams is deployment zone.
- No Eyes & Ears anymore (can't lift Gone to Ground)
- No dis-engagement move anymore
+ Cautions movement still in effect
- Recon does not push back ambushes anymore

US
- TDs rules changed. Instead of the pseudo ambush, TDs now can attempt two movement orders that could allow them to "Blitz", shoot full, and "Shoot and Scoot" out of LOS. That assumes passing BOTH move order skill checks.
+ TD security section is now its own unit and has Recon - one unit became two.
+ Time on Target Remains - Reroll saves if 1st range in is successful on infantry and guns not tanks
- Detroit's Finest is now just +2" to terrain and cross-country dash (not tactical speed)
+ Truscott Trot is +2" to terrain and cross-country dash (not tactical speed)
+ Under Command Remains - Any US unit leader can call in artillery like the CO
+ Automatic Rifles and Dismounted MGs remains the same
+ Duck Bills rule expanded to all books/periods. +1 to cross check and makes tank slow.
-/+ Stabilizer US Tanks must use stabilizer and shoot full ROF now with +1 to hit.
- Tank Telephone, column security, hit them with everything you got, and some other US rules gone
- Hedgerow Cutter - reroll on cross checks of Bocage/Hedge but only for vehicle w/ cutters.
- Jumbos - swaps his on 2+ vice 3+
- Smooth Ride is now a cross roll on 2+

German
+ "Stormtrooper" has become ability to attempt a 2nd movement order (see US TDs above) - This could include Blitz, Shoot, and dig in for infantry. I have a question: Can a FLaK 36 (immobile) Blitz, shoot, and Shoot & Scoot?
- Kampfgrouppe Gone
- Mission Tactics now not German unique - changed to a universal rule
+ Tiger Ace Change a -1 on roll need to remount. Makes fearless w/ protected ammo remount on a 1+. Only Tiger Tank Formation Commander gets to "Every Shot Counts" reroll on misses. No rolling for ace skill anymore, Tiger Ace dice have become necessary. It seem Tigers are more survivable less now, but potential less lethal.
+ Stuka Zu Fuss - One shot big pipe template but with single weapon (reroll hits), acts as a normal transport afterwards - seems simpler to me. WWPD crew thinks they have the chance to reload like other big rockets.
- Beglits - Add one more shot at 8" to tank MGs and allow tank to reroll close combat missies
- Reich Divided is gone.

British
+ Free Bagpipes for any British infantry formation - All units within 6" of Bagpipe are pinned on 6 hits instead of 5.
-/+ British Artillery are now deployed as separate units of 4 guns
- All guns repeat is now a universal rule
- Mike Target - British FOs can get a 1st ranged in attempt with two artillery units
- Night Attack now is only allowed when the enemy has minefields (only present in a few mission) - Minefields are mandatory, Night Attack is optional, Support can't leave deployment zone until dawn, no Spearhead with it for free
- British Bulldog It it's not a reroll but would be a +1 to your counter attack roll.
- Removed - Broadsides
-/+ Tip and Run -1 to make Shoot and Scoot
- Tally Ho - Increase score to pass tactics test by +1, but get a tactical speed of 12"
-/+ Tow Hooks no change
-/+ Semi-Indirect no change
- Removed - Carry On Sergeant, Broadsides, Combined Bombardment, Independent Command


Soviets
- "Quality of Quantity" now universal. You only have to have 12 teams to get it, and if you are the units is pinned on 8" hits. So easier to get, but less effective when you do get it. US, Japanese, Italians, and occasionally Germans will be able to take advantage of this rule.
-/+ Kommisar seems about the same, Kommisar still dies anymore on the roll of a "1" now.
-/+ Volley Fire seems the same - can't use Volley Fire when ambushing
-/+ Steel Wall - Soviet Artillery are now deployed as separate units
- "Hen and Chicks" now applied to MGs as well as main guns
-/+ Infiltration like Spearhead but can get within 14" enemy teams/deployment zone if concealed, no chance to give up 1st turn
-/+ Cat Killers - no change
-/+ Bring up the guns - no change
-/+ Straff Company - no change
-/+ Tankdesentniki - same as German Beglit with 4" range
+ V4 Base morale rules really favor the big Soviet Units
- Gone - Quality of Quantity, Copula, Centralized Control

Missions

Reserves are now 40% force points, YOU DO NOT HAVE TO BRING ON RESERVES Attachments go in reserve with unit, can't use movement orders to enter the table

Deep Reserves - no more than one tank unit with armor 3+ can deploy or one

Flank Reserves - one unit must go in reserves, may place more

Scattered Reserves - same

Can't leave table - units cannot be pulled now except for Fighting Withdraw mission for the defender

Deploying - within 6" of unit leader, 8" for big units

All Infantry and Gun teams start off in FOXHOLES, all teams start Gone-to-ground

Three ways to determine attacker/defender - Agree, Random, or who has more infantry platoons. TOs pick? No more always attack, always defend

Hasty Attack - Immediate Ambush is now a regular ambush

Ambush - Same...but infantry in transports in ambush deploy mounted in those transports

Annihilation - No objectives, just kill everything - not likely to be seen in tournaments?

Dust-Up - center of board has a 12" bubble from center cut out of the deployment zone.

Counter Attack - Attack's quadrant MUST be diagonal to the Defender's, 12" bubble dead zone from center again

No Retreat - Now has free minefields for defender (1/25pts - so guess that mean 4 for a 100pt MW force...so 4 for an EW/LW force. Are they 2" TY type round templates or traditional 2" x 8" rectangles? The new minefield markers shown on the BF update last Thursday make me think it the prior.

Rear Guard (was Fighting Withdraw) has a new name (?) - Defender starts pulling off units on turn 2 (vice 3), units in poor spirits that are withdrawn count as destroyed, defender gets minefields (amount?), there are only two objectives placed now. Both stay on the board. Now has free minefields for defender (1/25pts - so guess that mean 4 for a 100pt MW force...so 4 for an EW/LW force. )

Breakthrough - Objectives location change, uses Flank Reserves, reserves enter 16" from corner , both directions

Bridgehead - Like Cauldron, with minefields, one unit in ambush, Deep Scattered Reserves for Defender

Victory Points
Count units destroyed, HQ units that are not independent teams, core units with attachments count as two units (like Panzergrenadiers w/ Halftracks)
0-1 units lost by winner = 8-1 win
2 units lost by winner = 7-2 win
3+ units lost by winner = 6-3 win

[Sarraceno]

Cagada! Se que es repetirme pero han copiado al 100% el TY y empeorando el resto.... Increible

[Tío Sam]

Minas gratis, misiones sin objetivos, sin listas auto attack/defend... cuanto mas hablan mas 'mejora' la cosa. Al ritmo al que van, que saquen un pdf descargable ya porque el manual poca chicha mas va a tener

[Covenant]

Estoy intentando procesar los tres post de cambios en conjunto y la cosa es muy chunga. Pero que muy chunga. Entiendo perfectamente lo que queria decir Raisdt con lo de que "nunca dudas que tienes que hacer". Gran parte del componente estrategico va a desaparecer de forma irremediable ( el uso del recon, ser paaciente con las guns o no, si correr el riesgo de usar transportes, el humo como componente ofensivo/defensivo es muy limitado)a cambio de un juego mucho mas piedra/papel/tijera donde las partidas seran decididas por composición de lista y las tiradas de dados (tanto a nivel de ordenes como de alpha strike).

Por supuesto acepto que se me pueden escapar matices pero...lo veo cada vez mas negro cuanto mas compketo veo el panorama

[Laro]

Dudas:
1) el trote truscott y el detroit finest son 5cm más de movimiento o qué? No entiendo :/
2) ¿Por qué el tot no vale para carros?
Osea, que si te expones a que te pegue artillería americana mejor meter a tu tropa en transporte o qué? ??? ¿?
3)Los US van a tener que quedarse con los carros quietos si quieren pegar a veteranos atrincherados????? XDDD Convierten una regla de la leche en una putadita ~~
4) ¿Los recon pueden desplegar donde quieran mientras estén a 40cm del enemigo? ???
5)Qué corcho son las órdenes esas de las que habla de blitz y todo eso? ?
6) Los tank scorts sólo repiten en cac? Osea que si te atascas al asalto adiós muy buenas... siguiendo la tónica no sé por qué repiten esos chismes en vei de hacer que los carros peguen a con un +1... No sé vosotros. Pero a mi me cuesta más recordar modificadores que volver a tirar.
7) Reich divided fuera por la cara... ¿?
Tigers remontando a +1...
9)como ya se ha dicho, no se si a los gurkhas les mola la gaita
10)¿All gun repeats universal? ?? Osea que la artillería alemana va a ser algo que no se va a volver a ver jamás.
11)¿Night attack??? Tienes que dejar medio ejército quieto en la zona de despliegue mientras el enemigo se puede mover con todo ¿¿¿????
12)Broadside fuera? ????? Pero si era lo único que molaba de la lista de crusaders
13) hen and chicks en ametralladoras XDDDDDDDDD Osea.... XD
14) y las cupulas fuera porque si también.
15) ¿Campos de minas gratis o una mina 5x5?
16) ¿Hq cuenta como unidad para puntos de victoria y la infantería con transporte si es combat cuenta como dos???
Bueno. ... las risas

Por cierto. La mayoría de + son las cosas que quedan como v3 pero bueno XD
Un saludo: Laro.

[PanzerKanone]

La mayoría de las reglas parecen un refrito y poco meditadas. A ver, que está claro que han querido hacer un sistema más simple y ligero, pero se pueden haber cargado muchas cosas. Todavía me río del nuevo No HE (que beneficia y mucho, pero que no hay por dónde cogerlo como regla).

Si al hecho de que sólo se puede disparar cañón o ametralladoras, le unimos que a estas también les afecta el Hen and Chicks, quizá empecemos a ver las Tankovys como algo no tan amenazador Ya os dije que me parecían burras sobre el papel, pero luego te encuentras que sus carros son basura y les cuesta disparar, excepto los T-34/85 que (espero) no te puedes hacer la lista completa con ellos (y aun así les sigue afectando el Hen and Chicks). Por lo tanto, podemos concebir el Hen and Chicks como lo que siempre ha sido, edición tras edición: una forma de equilibrar/capar a las Tankovys para que sus ingentes números no sean imposibles de manejar.

[Vikos777]

Lo de los scouts me hace bastante gracia, la mayor utilidad que le veo es para "adelantar la infantería todo lo que puedas" pero total la infantería ahora no vale de mucho...

[Comandante_Peiper]

Hola a tod@s, cada nuevo píldorazo de reglas es mejor que el anterior. Las nuevas "reglas nacionales" ufff muy meditadas si señor. Me llama mucho la atención que, siendo MID no se hable nada de italianos, ni una ligera mención ni en las "reglas nacionales". Espero que pronto saquen una V4.1 para volver a la cordura, por que sino parafraseando a los Doors "This is the end my Fow friend the end...".
Un saludete

[Tío Sam]

No hablan de italianos porque para ellos son un pais menor, y no estan hablando de Mid sino de la V4 en general. Pero vamos, imaginate que con los que son, pues ponle que ganan el Quantity ruso y el mission tactics aleman. Y respecto a sus reglas nacionales, a saber

[kombat]

Ufffff.... la que se avecina.... Y la liga catalana me da que el año que viene se hace en V4.... uffff

[Covenant]

A lo mejor es redundante, pero para facilitar las cosas he reunido todo lo que ha salido de reglas y lo cuelgo en un único tocho post:

Nota: algun moderador podria ponerlo en el primer post y vamos actualizando sobre la marcha? Para que todo sea mas sencillo

he rules - from the "Rough Draft" of V4 that was discussed:

Dice rolling: Can go above 6: 7 needs a 6 followed by a 5+, 8 needs 6 followed by a 6, 9+ is impossible.

Teams: Man-packed guns are now Infantry teams, with the heavy weapon special rule.

Guns are classified as small guns = light and medium and large guns = heavy and immobile. However it seems that the light, medium etc. categories also exist, e.g. for mobility.

Only one observer per force, who can be ground based or an AOP. Force commander and US unit commanders can still observe, as can guns.

Transport tank teams are attachments to their parent platoon, but can act independently with their own command teams.

Unit leaders are on small bases if there is one indicated in the army list, otherwise they can be any of the existing teams in the list.

Combat attachments can attach up to half their teams to eligible platoons.

Redundant teams: No more command teams, staff teams or observers for artillery and anti-tank gun platoons.

Formations: The order goes Force – Formations – Units – Team
A Force can have any number of formations. The first formation is the primary formation, who determines which support units can be taken. Further formations can be taken, if those platoons could be taken as a support choice. The example discussed was a US Rifle Company which could take a US Tank Destroyer Company as a second formation. The additional formations also need to satisfy their minimum requirements, i.e. usually need 1 HQ + 2 combat platoons. Additional formations need to be in the same book and same historical organisation (division, corps).
Additional formations cannot daisy-chain their own support units, i.e. if it isn’t available to the main formation, it is not available.
Warriors can be taken in any formation.

Motivation & skill tests: Have the basic categories (F/C/R & V/T/C), but with subcategories each. Motivation: Rally (to recover from being pinned), Remount (for bailed tanks), Counter attack (for assaults) and Last Stand (Morale checks)
Skill: Tactics, others not discussed.
Subcategories default to the basic rating, but can be different – often to replace what was formerly a re-roll.

Terrain: There is Tall and Short terrain.
Hills give now bullet proof cover, similar to linear terrain.
Wheat fields are short, concealing terrain.
Teams 2” from the edge of terrain can see out

Starting step sequence:
1. Remount
2. Rally from being pinned
3. Check for last stand of units (aka. Platoon morale, no more checks after shooting and assault step)
4. Check for last stand of formations (aka. Company morale)
5. Check victory conditions
6. Reveal Ambushes
7. Check for reserves
8. Check for air
9. Remove smoke

Last Stand: Units are in good spirits if they have either:
- No teams destroyed or bailed
Or
- 3+ Infantry teams
- 2+ Tank (not bailed)
- 2+ gun teams
- 1+ air craft
Units without a unit leader are never in good spirits

Units that aren’t in good spirits take a last stand test in the starting step. Take the test every step the conditions remain, even without taking further casualties. This test can be re-rolled if the 1iC is within 6” and LOS.
Units cannot leave the table. Attached units (Transports) are removed per special rules.

Formation last stand: A formation is in good spirits if it has at least 2 units, including the HQ (i.e. HQ + 1 Units), on the table or in reserves. Only combat and weapons platoons count, support platoons do not.
A force has lost if it has no remaining formations.

Movement:
Same categories as before, but 4 different speeds for each.
Tactical = Move and shoot (usually at RF 1)
Standard Tank 10”, Light Tank 12”, Fast tank 12”, Slow Tank 8”, Very Slow Tank 6”, Infantry 8”
Guns: Light 4”, Medium 2”, Heavy 2”, Immobile: Dash only.
Dash = Don’t shoot but move further. Similar to what doubling used to be, but no double shooting.
Terrain dash, cross-country dash, road dash.
No more bogging, Teams make a cross check and if they fail they simply stop moving.

Command: Platoons with less than 8 teams have a 6” command range from the unit leader (only), larger platoons have 8”.
Out of command teams can move at tactical speed with +1 to shooting or dash towards the unit leader.
Teams need to stay 8” away from enemies if dashing. 2” away from enemies otherwise – except tank and gun teams who can move into contact to each other, but not through other tank or gun teams (enemy and friendly).

Sending transports to the rear: Mandatory for unarmed and(or?) unarmoured teams, optional for others. Can be brought forward again within 4” of their parent unit and 16” away from enemies.
Passengers get 3+ saves.

Movement special orders: All of them only affect teams in command distance of the unit leader, alle tests are made by the unit leader (or the 1iC, if attached)
- Follow me: Unit leader moves 4” directly ahead, makes a motivation check, teams in command can also move 4” forward. No shooting, but can be done after dashing.
- Blitz: UL makes Skill check to move teams 4” before moving at tactical speed. Units can still shoot at full ROF after a Blitz. If a check is failed, teams can only move at tactical speed and get +1 to shoot, as if being out of command.
- Shoot and Scoot. Teams who haven’t moved before can move 4” instead of assaulting, if they pass a tactics roll (skill test).
- Dig in: skill test to gain concealment and BP cover (all teams, incl. large guns) instead of moving. Shoot at moving ROF, no bombardments, GtG if not shooting, no assaulting. Can be decided on a team basis, so part of the platoon can dig in while others don’t.
- Cross here: Test before moving, make cross checks easier, for teams crossing within 6” of the UL (and the UL himself). No shooting.
General trend to replace re-rolls with easier dice rolls. E.g. wide tracks is a -1 to the cross check.

Aircraft: Arrive on a 4+, some on a 3+, in the movement step. Can be placed anywhere where the stand can be placed on the table top.
1 – 3 planes corresponding to sporadic, limited and priority options. Once a plane is shot down, it is gone, casualties carry over to later turns.
MGs & Cannon 8” Range, ROF 3 or 2, respectively. Each plane shoots individually.
Bombs Rockets: Artillery template, the planes fire as a battery
Planes are hit on 5+, get a 3+ save and need a FP check to be shot down. Flying tanks get a +1 on the FP check.
AOP: Rules unclear. They arrive in the starting step, but otherwise much confusion.
Fighter interception happens on 5+, but it is not clear who can get it (other than those forces where it is specifically an option).
Shooting
1. Hit allocation is like TY
2. “No HE” can now shoot at Inf/Guns with a +1 hit
3. Tanks cannot shoot MGs and Main Guns at the same time
4. When shooting a tank you can turn the turret or turn the hull (up to 90 degrees) to face the target
5. All teams can rotate up to 90 degrees to face target when shooting, but now they face the target team, not just any team in the unit
6. Heavy Weapons (old Man-Packed gun teams), Light, & Medium guns now have a 3+ save, Heavy /Immobile have a 4+ save
7. Recon Jeeps and Gun Shielded portee now have a 4+ save, other unarmored tank teams have a 5+ save
8. Passengers get a their normal save when transport destroyed
9. Flamethrowers – don’t run out of fuel, don’t auto-kill (but reroll saves as "Breakthrough Guns" with AT2 FP 1+), hit on target skill
10. Units with 12+ teams pinned on 8+ hits, smaller than 12 team still pinned on 5 hits
11. Smoke +1 to hit if LOS goes through direct fire smoke
12. Breakthrough Guns don't auto kill infantry & guns, instead they reroll saves (inferred from Flamethrower)

Artillery
1. One Observer Team Only per Force (we knew that from Ep 10)
2. Artillery units get a “pre plot” target at game start can range in even with no observer LOS (but w/ a +1)
3. Artillery can range in on any point of ground
4. Artillery in units get only one smoke use per game
5. Mortars and Rockets are considered “Artillery” units.
6. Bombardment AT dropped, but FP went up
AT 6 -> AT 3 FP 1 -> FP 1
AT 5 -> AT 3 FP 2 -> FP 2
AT 4 -> AT 3 FP 3 -> FP 3
AT 3 -> AT 2 FP 4 -> FP 3
AT 2 -> AT 1 FP 5 -> FP 4
FP 6 -> FP 4
Best you can do now to a TA 2 Tank is a bail
7. Staff, Command, & Observer teams gone (Ep 10) but all Artillery can stay ranged in now like it had a staff team
8. Target teams in bombardment hit on THEIR skill after a bombardment is ranged in
9. If an observer or gun team does not have LOS to the ranged in marker it’s a +1 to hit
10. All Artillery cause save rerolls on a repeat bombardment
11. Ranging in is based on shooter skill and number of weapons shooting, +1 if target is concealed, does not seem like GTG matters for ranging in, Range in at Night does not need a roll for visibility range but gets a +1
12. Bombardment Smoke is now 4” “strip” for each weapon shooting laid out in a straight line (no concern for wind direction?), cannot shoot more than 6” through smoke, you don’t have to use all weapons if you want a shorter “screen” but it still burns the units one smoke use
13. Some Rockets have some weird rules like count as multiple weapons (I’m fuzzy on these) Some get double size templates, some devastating template. I really need to see these rules to understand them.
14. Observers can range in multiple artillery units, one at a time, until they fail. Sounds like the 2nd artillery unit will get no better that "2nd success, 3rd artillery no better than "3rd success"
15. AOP - must be 16" from the bombardment aiming point, AAA gets a chance to shoot at the AOP BEFORE the bombardment

Assaults
1. Only teams 4” from an enemy can assault, defensive fire still from teams up to 8” away though
2. No more 2” close combat range, now must touch/contact target team or a friendly team in contact with a target team.
3. No more Tank Terror?
4. If a Command Team Joins the attack, unit takes on command team’s morale for counter attacks
5. Shurzen - SA 5 vs Infantry FP 5 or 6 weapons
6. Small (2 man) teams have a +1 to hit disadvantage in close combat (Lt Mortar, PIAT, Bazooka etc)
7. Loser must back off 6" from assaulting teams
8. Attackers can use main weapon vs. Tanks side armor in assaults ( Panzerfaust vs. Sherman = Auto bail)


Other
1. Formation commanders appoint new unit leaders at the start of ANY step and at 6" range
2. Airplanes get a save now, then FP test. Harder to kill but are permanently dead when KO'd.

Recon
+ Recon units can deploy up to 16" from an enemy team or enemy deployment zone.
+ Once deployed the Recon team creates an 8" "bubble" that other units can later deploy in. I/m not sure later deployment is effected by distance from enemy teams is deployment zone.
- No Eyes & Ears anymore (can't lift Gone to Ground)
- No dis-engagement move anymore
+ Cautions movement still in effect
- Recon does not push back ambushes anymore

US
- TDs rules changed. Instead of the pseudo ambush, TDs now can attempt two movement orders that could allow them to "Blitz", shoot full, and "Shoot and Scoot" out of LOS. That assumes passing BOTH move order skill checks.
+ TD security section is now its own unit and has Recon - one unit became two.
+ Time on Target Remains - Reroll saves if 1st range in is successful on infantry and guns not tanks
- Detroit's Finest is now just +2" to terrain and cross-country dash (not tactical speed)
+ Truscott Trot is +2" to terrain and cross-country dash (not tactical speed)
+ Under Command Remains - Any US unit leader can call in artillery like the CO
+ Automatic Rifles and Dismounted MGs remains the same
+ Duck Bills rule expanded to all books/periods. +1 to cross check and makes tank slow.
-/+ Stabilizer US Tanks must use stabilizer and shoot full ROF now with +1 to hit.
- Tank Telephone, column security, hit them with everything you got, and some other US rules gone
- Hedgerow Cutter - reroll on cross checks of Bocage/Hedge but only for vehicle w/ cutters.
- Jumbos - swaps his on 2+ vice 3+
- Smooth Ride is now a cross roll on 2+

German
+ "Stormtrooper" has become ability to attempt a 2nd movement order (see US TDs above) - This could include Blitz, Shoot, and dig in for infantry. I have a question: Can a FLaK 36 (immobile) Blitz, shoot, and Shoot & Scoot?
- Kampfgrouppe Gone
- Mission Tactics now not German unique - changed to a universal rule
+ Tiger Ace Change a -1 on roll need to remount. Makes fearless w/ protected ammo remount on a 1+. Only Tiger Tank Formation Commander gets to "Every Shot Counts" reroll on misses. No rolling for ace skill anymore, Tiger Ace dice have become necessary. It seem Tigers are more survivable less now, but potential less lethal.
+ Stuka Zu Fuss - One shot big pipe template but with single weapon (reroll hits), acts as a normal transport afterwards - seems simpler to me. WWPD crew thinks they have the chance to reload like other big rockets.
- Beglits - Add one more shot at 8" to tank MGs and allow tank to reroll close combat missies
- Reich Divided is gone.

British
+ Free Bagpipes for any British infantry formation - All units within 6" of Bagpipe are pinned on 6 hits instead of 5.
-/+ British Artillery are now deployed as separate units of 4 guns
- All guns repeat is now a universal rule
- Mike Target - British FOs can get a 1st ranged in attempt with two artillery units
- Night Attack now is only allowed when the enemy has minefields (only present in a few mission) - Minefields are mandatory, Night Attack is optional, Support can't leave deployment zone until dawn, no Spearhead with it for free
- British Bulldog It it's not a reroll but would be a +1 to your counter attack roll.
- Removed - Broadsides
-/+ Tip and Run -1 to make Shoot and Scoot
- Tally Ho - Increase score to pass tactics test by +1, but get a tactical speed of 12"
-/+ Tow Hooks no change
-/+ Semi-Indirect no change
- Removed - Carry On Sergeant, Broadsides, Combined Bombardment, Independent Command


Soviets
- "Quality of Quantity" now universal. You only have to have 12 teams to get it, and if you are the units is pinned on 8" hits. So easier to get, but less effective when you do get it. US, Japanese, Italians, and occasionally Germans will be able to take advantage of this rule.
-/+ Kommisar seems about the same, Kommisar still dies anymore on the roll of a "1" now.
-/+ Volley Fire seems the same - can't use Volley Fire when ambushing
-/+ Steel Wall - Soviet Artillery are now deployed as separate units
- "Hen and Chicks" now applied to MGs as well as main guns
-/+ Infiltration like Spearhead but can get within 14" enemy teams/deployment zone if concealed, no chance to give up 1st turn
-/+ Cat Killers - no change
-/+ Bring up the guns - no change
-/+ Straff Company - no change
-/+ Tankdesentniki - same as German Beglit with 4" range
+ V4 Base morale rules really favor the big Soviet Units
- Gone - Quality of Quantity, Copula, Centralized Control

Missions

Reserves are now 40% force points, YOU DO NOT HAVE TO BRING ON RESERVES Attachments go in reserve with unit, can't use movement orders to enter the table

Deep Reserves - no more than one tank unit with armor 3+ can deploy or one

Flank Reserves - one unit must go in reserves, may place more

Scattered Reserves - same

Can't leave table - units cannot be pulled now except for Fighting Withdraw mission for the defender

Deploying - within 6" of unit leader, 8" for big units

All Infantry and Gun teams start off in FOXHOLES, all teams start Gone-to-ground

Three ways to determine attacker/defender - Agree, Random, or who has more infantry platoons. TOs pick? No more always attack, always defend

Hasty Attack - Immediate Ambush is now a regular ambush

Ambush - Same...but infantry in transports in ambush deploy mounted in those transports

Annihilation - No objectives, just kill everything - not likely to be seen in tournaments?

Dust-Up - center of board has a 12" bubble from center cut out of the deployment zone.

Counter Attack - Attack's quadrant MUST be diagonal to the Defender's, 12" bubble dead zone from center again

No Retreat - Now has free minefields for defender (1/25pts - so guess that mean 4 for a 100pt MW force...so 4 for an EW/LW force. Are they 2" TY type round templates or traditional 2" x 8" rectangles? The new minefield markers shown on the BF update last Thursday make me think it the prior.

Rear Guard (was Fighting Withdraw) has a new name (?) - Defender starts pulling off units on turn 2 (vice 3), units in poor spirits that are withdrawn count as destroyed, defender gets minefields (amount?), there are only two objectives placed now. Both stay on the board. Now has free minefields for defender (1/25pts - so guess that mean 4 for a 100pt MW force...so 4 for an EW/LW force. )

Breakthrough - Objectives location change, uses Flank Reserves, reserves enter 16" from corner , both directions

Bridgehead - Like Cauldron, with minefields, one unit in ambush, Deep Scattered Reserves for Defender

Victory Points
Count units destroyed, HQ units that are not independent teams, core units with attachments count as two units (like Panzergrenadiers w/ Halftracks)
0-1 units lost by winner = 8-1 win
2 units lost by winner = 7-2 win
3+ units lost by winner = 6-3 win


Ale, ya no teneis que buscar entre páginas para los lloros, xD

[Raistd]

Os lo avisamos, es un refrito tontificado y complejo del TY con miniaturas de la WWII con listas por ahora iguales a la v3 sin apenas probar en serio y que demuestra el poco interes que le tienen al juego.

Todas y cada una de las reglas estan poco pensadas y empeoran lo actual salvo dos o tres pinceladas. Solo hay que ver que hay un escenario sin objetivos, vamos para atras como los cangrejos.

[Sarraceno]

Os lo avisamos, es un refrito tontificado y complejo del TY con miniaturas de la WWII con listas por ahora iguales a la v3 sin apenas probar en serio y que demuestra el poco interes que le tienen al juego.

Todas y cada una de las reglas estan poco pensadas y empeoran lo actual salvo dos o tres pinceladas. Solo hay que ver que hay un escenario sin objetivos, vamos para atras como los cangrejos.

TY tiene lagunas en las reglas, pero V4 va a parecer un lago de estiercol

[PanzerKanone]

Solo hay que ver que hay un escenario sin objetivos, vamos para atras como los cangrejos.

¿Un escenario sin objetivos? ¿Esto qué es, FOWHammer?